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Priscilla
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PostSubject: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 09:11

Just in case there are any of the old gang also looking into the site from time to time, seasonal greetings and warm cheer in memory of the good ol' days here - even to the non Christmas observers and  you old humbuggers (assorted.) Regards, P.
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Nielsen
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 10:29

Thank you for the greeting, Priscilla.
Admittedly I'm old - yet never in a gang!

And a Merry Christmas to you too, P., where I come from it's still pc to mention 'holy days' by their religious names and not just joining them together as 'seasonal' - thus not so much humbug.

Regards to all of you from me.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 10:43

All the bugs are coming out of the woodwork and humming this morning. That can't be bad - can it?


Merry Whatever to all at Res His - please don't let the old place die a death. Was it really seven years ago that nord - blessing be upon him - started the site?

Thank you, sir - and please do not disappear for good (or bad).



PS Ferval - hope you are out there.
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 13:05

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all at Res.

Et in terra pax hominibus 8c92bcb70f835e8c353e2489193b4364
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nordmann
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 13:05

Happy Christmas/God Jul/Nollaig Sonas/Felic Sol Invictus etc to each and all from me too.

Having a quiet one this year, so apologies if it resembles a disappearance. But then again, "multa paucis", as Mr Aurelius might have said.
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 13:45

As Tiny Tim (not he of Aclea) said, "Merry Christmas everyone" (or should it be every one). Believers and non-believers, I hope you enjoy the day.


Last edited by LadyinRetirement on Mon 24 Dec 2018, 14:25; edited 1 time in total
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Meles meles
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Meles meles

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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 14:17

Well this dippy old badger forgot to block his diary dates this year and so got surprised in late Summer by a booking for Christmas. Oh humbugger indeed! But as I've now got paying guests over Christmas I felt I ought to make a bit of an effort and so I've actually put up a tree and decorations for the first time since 2010. I've even constructed a wreath for the front door out of a wire coat-hanger, holly and fir boughs (à la 'Blue Peter') and made other seasonal 'floral' decorations for the communal rooms and breakfast table. Thankfully though my guests are attending a big family get-together in the village so I just need to do breakfasts and I don't have to prepare the whole French révellon and répas de Noël multi-course eating extravaganza.

So for this year I've actually got quite into the whole thing ... although since I'm working I intend to have my Christmas on the 27th once everyone has gone and it'll be just me the cats and Doggy-Dog.

So happy Christmas - or happy Shadenfreudefest to borrow Temp's phrase - to everyone.
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 14:28

@Triceratops wrote:
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all at Res.

Et in terra pax hominibus 8c92bcb70f835e8c353e2489193b4364
Where's this one from, Trike?  I wish I was as adept as you (and Nielson and MM) as finding the comic angle to various subjects.
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Triceratops
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 14:41

LiR,
pinterest.co.uk

Pinterest

there's all sorts of stuff on there.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyMon 24 Dec 2018, 18:07

nordman wrote:


Having a quiet one this year, so apologies if it resembles a disappearance. But then again, "multa paucis", as Mr Aurelius might have said.




Well, you always say much, be it in few or many words.

Hope you are OK. I am sure I speak for us all when I say I hope that we shall see (read) more of you in the New Year.

Still haven't done the sprouts, so alas discussion of the Logos must wait until 2019 - but will comment, Tim. It's such an interesting subject.   Smile Fighting drunken
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Dirk Marinus
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyTue 25 Dec 2018, 10:03

and from me just in simple words :

"a Very Merry Christmas to each and everyone"


Dirk
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Caro
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyWed 26 Dec 2018, 02:03

Christmas Day is over here and I think it is the middle of the night for most of you. We've had an elongated Xmas, with all of us here (except our children in Nottingham) for a Christmas dinner on Saturday and another one yesterday with just our nearby kids. I am just amazed at how many presents people give their kids these days, and sometimes think of the others who get next to nothing. But I have learnt not to say this out loud.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyWed 26 Dec 2018, 21:57

@Dirk Marinus wrote:
and from me just in simple words :

"a Very Merry Christmas to each and everyone"


Dirk


I join my nearly compatriot, once starting life in the Low Countries as me and perhaps having retained a bit of our culture during the  later wanderings till ending there (not that far?) near Newcastle...

Merry Christmas to all of you. 'n Zalig en Gelukkig Kerstfeest (as we say it overhere, literally: "a blessed and happy Christ feast")
Lady returning from revalidation to the house on the last day of 2018 with a new hip...not too much time...

Kind regards from Paul.
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Vizzer
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyThu 27 Dec 2018, 23:42

@PaulRyckier wrote:
as we say it overhere, literally

Paul that reminds me of the debate in the Finnish language regarding whether 'Sota on ohi' is a translation or just a transliteration of 'War is over'. This stems from the famous black and white billboards which appeared in different languages in cities around the world in December 1971 with a message from John and Yoko (promoting their song Happy Xmas (War Is Over). The one in Helsinki was to be found off the stylish Kaivokatu there. Some Finns suggest that a better translation in Finnish would be 'Sota ohi on'. Others, however, argue that Sota on ohi is a perfectly acceptable translation and that to quibble about the order of the words is to spectacularly miss the internationalist point of the message as outlined in Priscilla's opening post. Others again might suggest that Mr Lennon was something of a canting hypocrite for spouting words of love and peace while simultaneously behaving abysmally towards his own son Julian and also (allegedly) gun-running for the IRA. But maybe that's for another thread.

The Finnish language is, after all, an incredibly difficult language to master and any non-Finn who does so must immediately graduate to among the first ranks of the world's linguists. Finnish has more grammatical cases (15) then there are days of Christmas (12). And anyone who has sung or has heard the song The Twelve Days of Christmas knows just how long and drawn out that can be. Just imagine a similar song or aide memoir designed to assist the learner of Finnish in remembering the ablative, the adessive, the elative and the inessive etc. Maybe such a thing exists for schoolchildren in Finland. I don’t know.

What I do know, however, is that The Twelve Days of Christmas is itself prone to mishearings and mistranslations. Today is the Third Day of Christmas which in the song equates with ‘three French hens’. Some think that the words may have originally been three French horns. A French horn was originally a hunting horn with winter hunts traditional beginning after Christmas. And staying with French – the French word for a partridge (the gift of the First Day) is ‘perdrix’ which sounds strikingly similar to the English ‘pear tree’ in which said partridge is supposedly roosting. Mmm. In short the song is a linguistic and etymological quagmire.  

For the remaining 9 days, however, Merry Christmas!
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Nielsen
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 10:01

Quote :

@PaulRyckier wrote:
@Dirk Marinus wrote:
and from me just in simple words :

"a Very Merry Christmas to each and everyone"


Dirk


I join my nearly compatriot, once starting life in the Low Countries as me and perhaps having retained a bit of our culture during the  later wanderings till ending there (not that far?) near Newcastle...

Merry Christmas to all of you. 'n Zalig en Gelukkig Kerstfeest (as we say it overhere, literally: "a blessed and happy Christ feast")
Lady returning from revalidation to the house on the last day of 2018 with a new hip...not too much time...

Kind regards from Paul.



Re yours, "Lady returning from revalidation to the house on the last day of 2018 with a new hip...not too much time..."



There are uneasy times, Paul, when one must say that ’such is life’, I hope you’ll soon be able to concentrate on the good sides of what’s happening, that your good Lady has and shall receive the help and instructions enabling her to rest and continue her - and your - life as you'll both want to. Perhaps a comment to the revalidation people on what seem to be realistic in just your*) situation and what not.

There might be something in the instructions you haven’t noticed, which could have given support to Madame or to you, point out that with better instructions could be personalized and perhaps received better. A cool brain and a warm heart on their side could be a God-send to the patient instead of a standard pack handed out by a Civil Servant to a client.*)

 

My best wishes for a good recovery with the help and good instructions from physiotherapists**) that will be needed.

 

*) Note: ‘Just William’.




**) Note: As I actually know next to nothing about Belgium's health care, I can and am here speaking in general terms.

 

***) Note: I have occasionally felt the need to call such staff ‘physio-terrorists’, as they can and do - at least here - chase patients around doing lots of exercises while apparently doing bu***r-all but watching themselves. A comment from me to them have at such times been along lines that ‘there’s nothing too hard or complicated for he, who doesn’t have to do it himself.’

 

Take care of yourselves in the times coming up.


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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 10:58

@Vizzer wrote:

What I do know, however, is that The Twelve Days of Christmas is itself prone to mishearings and mistranslations. Today is the Third Day of Christmas which in the song equates with ‘three French hens’. Some think that the words may have originally been three French horns. A French horn was originally a hunting horn with winter hunts traditional beginning after Christmas. And staying with French – the French word for a partridge (the gift of the First Day) is ‘perdrix’ which sounds strikingly similar to the English ‘pear tree’ in which said partridge is supposedly roosting. Mmm. In short the song is a linguistic and etymological quagmire.  

And today, the 28th, is the fourth day of Christmas and so as the song goes my true love sent to me "four calling birds". Or did they? Early printed versions of the song usually have it as "colly" or "collie" birds", that is, coal-black birds, meaning the common blackbird (Turdus merula), while subsequent versions had variously; coloured, canary, or curley birds.

There is a similar cumulative traditional song from northern Franch usually known as 'Les Douze Mois' - 'The Twelve Months' (the title says months although the song itself mentioned days), and it is also sometimes called 'La Perdriole' - 'The Partridge song'. The final (twelfth) verse, as given in 'Chants Populaires des Flamands de France' (1856) goes:

Le douzièm' jour d'l'année, [the twelfth day of the year]
Que me donn'rez vous ma mie? [what will you give me, my love?]
Douze coqs chantants, [twelve singing cockerels]
Onze plats d'argent, [eleven silver dishes]
Dix pigeons blancs, [ten white pigeons]
Neuf bœufs cornus, [nine horned oxen]
Huit vaches mordants, [eight biting cows]
Sept moulins à vent, [seven windmills]
Six chiens courants, [six running dogs]
Cinq lapins courant par terre, [five rabbits running along the ground]
Quat' canards volant en l'air, [four ducks flying in the air]
Trois rameaux de bois, [three wooden branches]
Deux tourterelles, [two turtle doves]
Un' perdrix sole, [one lone partridge]
Qui va, qui vient, qui vole, [who goes, who comes, who flies]
Qui vole dans les bois. [who flies in the woods]

Note the above partridge specifically flies in the woods rather like the pear-tree perching partidge of the English song. The native English, common or grey partridge (Perdix perdix), usually stays on the ground amongst open pasture or agricultural land, and very rarely perches in trees or even enters orchards and woodland - unlike the red-legged or French partridge (Alectoris rufa) which does perch in trees. The French partidge was not successfully introduced into England until about 1780, which is the date at which the English song, 'The Twelve Days of Christmas' first appeared in print.
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LadyinRetirement
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 12:21

I'd heard that Finnish had many cases, Vizzer but I did not know it was as many as 15.  Coming from a Catholic background I had some schoolfellows who were the children of displaced Poles (after World War II) so I knew Polish had a lot of cases, I had been told it had more than Latin (which has 6 if I remember correctly).  I mentioned Polish (which I don't speak) having many cases in conversation once and somebody added that Finnish had more.  And here's more me trying to get to grips with the Spanish subjunctive.  I missed the introduction to the subjunctive mood in my U3A Spanish lessons so have been watching a few videos* to try and make up what I missed.  I know it has to do with uncertainty but there seem to be some peculiarities of its use in Spanish that I can't get my head around.  * And not one of the videos about a conspiracy theory.

MM, well spotted about the co-incidence concerning the Twelve Days of Christmas first being printed and the introduction of the French partridge into England.

Paul, I hope things will go as smoothly as possible for your wife upon her discharge from hospital.
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Temperance
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 13:34

Larry the Cat has done his own Twelve Days of Christmas. Precious little peace and goodwill from Number 10 cat, I'm afraid, as Larry's version of the traditional song tells of mass avian slaughter: Larry boasts of having eaten the French hens, all the doves, the calling birds and the solitary partridge.

He also enjoyed a goose omelette.

He hesitated somewhat about the seven swans, as these birds all belong to Her Majesty, but in the end demolished them too.

As for not a mouse stirring on the night before Christmas, one stupid rodent did, and Larry apparently ate that too.



PS Sorry if this should be on the Moggy Thread
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Meles meles
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 13:48

Larry could have eaten the "five gold rings" too if, as has been suggested, they were originally five goldspinks, which was a colloquial name for goldfinches.

..... But might not the partridge actually be a magpie? (Un pie in French). There is an old drinking song from the 17th century (recorded by William Sandys the 19th century antiquarian) which goes:

A pye sate on a pear tree, Heigh O!
Once so merrily hopp'd she; Heigh O!
Twice so merrily, Heigh O!
Thrice so, etc, ...


And there's also a similar French children's song that goes,

Y'a une pie dans l' poirier
J'entends la mère qui chante
Y'a une pie dans l' poirier
J'entends la mère chanter
J'entends, j'entends
J'entends la mère qui chante,
J'entends, j'entends
J'entends la mère chanter.


There's a magpie in the pear-tree,
I hear the mother singing,
There's a magpie in the pear-tree,
I hear the mother sing.
I hear, I hear,
I hear the mother singing,
I hear, I hear,
I hear the mother sing.

And with regard to magpies - which do most definitely perch in groups in trees - remember there's also the English counting game in relation to the number of magpies seen together:

One for sorrow,
Two for joy,
Three for a girl,
Four for a boy,
Five for silver,
Six for gold,
Seven for a secret,
Never to be told, etc...,
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 22:52

@Vizzer wrote:
@PaulRyckier wrote:
as we say it overhere, literally

Paul that reminds me of the debate in the Finnish language regarding whether 'Sota on ohi' is a translation or just a transliteration of 'War is over'. This stems from the famous black and white billboards which appeared in different languages in cities around the world in December 1971 with a message from John and Yoko (promoting their song Happy Xmas (War Is Over). The one in Helsinki was to be found off the stylish Kaivokatu there. Some Finns suggest that a better translation in Finnish would be 'Sota ohi on'. Others, however, argue that Sota on ohi is a perfectly acceptable translation and that to quibble about the order of the words is to spectacularly miss the internationalist point of the message as outlined in Priscilla's opening post. Others again might suggest that Mr Lennon was something of a canting hypocrite for spouting words of love and peace while simultaneously behaving abysmally towards his own son Julian and also (allegedly) gun-running for the IRA. But maybe that's for another thread.

The Finnish language is, after all, an incredibly difficult language to master and any non-Finn who does so must immediately graduate to among the first ranks of the world's linguists. Finnish has more grammatical cases (15) then there are days of Christmas (12). And anyone who has sung or has heard the song The Twelve Days of Christmas knows just how long and drawn out that can be. Just imagine a similar song or aide memoir designed to assist the learner of Finnish in remembering the ablative, the adessive, the elative and the inessive etc. Maybe such a thing exists for schoolchildren in Finland. I don’t know.

What I do know, however, is that The Twelve Days of Christmas is itself prone to mishearings and mistranslations. Today is the Third Day of Christmas which in the song equates with ‘three French hens’. Some think that the words may have originally been three French horns. A French horn was originally a hunting horn with winter hunts traditional beginning after Christmas. And staying with French – the French word for a partridge (the gift of the First Day) is ‘perdrix’ which sounds strikingly similar to the English ‘pear tree’ in which said partridge is supposedly roosting. Mmm. In short the song is a linguistic and etymological quagmire.  

For the remaining 9 days, however, Merry Christmas!

Vizzer,

"Paul that reminds me of the debate in the Finnish language regarding whether 'Sota on ohi' is a translation or just a transliteration of 'War is over'. This stems from the famous black and white billboards which appeared in different languages in cities around the world in December 1971 with a message from John and Yoko (promoting their song Happy Xmas (War Is Over). The one in Helsinki was to be found off the stylish Kaivokatu there. Some Finns suggest that a better translation in Finnish would be 'Sota ohi on'. Others, however, argue that Sota on ohi is a perfectly acceptable translation and that to quibble about the order of the words is to spectacularly miss the internationalist point of the message as outlined in Priscilla's opening post. Others again might suggest that Mr Lennon was something of a canting hypocrite for spouting words of love and peace while simultaneously behaving abysmally towards his own son Julian and also (allegedly) gun-running for the IRA. But maybe that's for another thread."

I heard about John Lennon and I read more about the Vietnam War...but that's all...even that world around... Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed
Am I now as nordmann pointed to that stupid uninterested in politics floating mass...?
Had to search it all on the internet... Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed

"The Finnish language is, after all, an incredibly difficult language to master and any non-Finn who does so must immediately graduate to among the first ranks of the world's linguists. Finnish has more grammatical cases (15) then there are days of Christmas (12). And anyone who has sung or has heard the song The Twelve Days of Christmas knows just how long and drawn out that can be. Just imagine a similar song or aide memoir designed to assist the learner of Finnish in remembering the ablative, the adessive, the elative and the inessive etc. Maybe such a thing exists for schoolchildren in Finland. I don’t know.
What I do know, however, is that The Twelve Days of Christmas is itself prone to mishearings and mistranslations. Today is the Third Day of Christmas which in the song equates with ‘three French hens’. Some think that the words may have originally been three French horns. A French horn was originally a hunting horn with winter hunts traditional beginning after Christmas. And staying with French – the French word for a partridge (the gift of the First Day) is ‘perdrix’ which sounds strikingly similar to the English ‘pear tree’ in which said partridge is supposedly roosting. Mmm. In short the song is a linguistic and etymological quagmire."

Again I have to admit that I didn't heard about that song Embarassed Embarassed Embarassed , although MM gives the example of:
There is a similar cumulative traditional song from northern Franch usually known as 'Les Douze Mois' - 'The Twelve Months' (the title says months although the song itself mentioned days), and it is also sometimes called 'La Perdriole' - 'The Partridge song'. The final (twelfth) verse, as given in 'Chants Populaires des Flamands de France' (1856) goes:
"Chants Populaires des Flamands de France (1856)" But yes 1856 is a long time ago...
https://www.vox.com/2015/12/25/10661878/12-days-of-christmas-explained




And about Finnish, yes I knew as I learned about it when studying Russian. The Finnish-Ugric as Finnish, Sami, Hungarian, Estonian...yes no related to Germanic, Romance or Slavic. The hordes of the East ran between the Fins and the Hungarians and let Hungary as a language island in the middle of the "others"
https://www.quora.com/Why-is-Finnish-in-particular-a-hard-language-to-learn
https://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2016/10/21/hungarian/


Kind regards from Paul.
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PaulRyckier
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PostSubject: Re: Et in terra pax hominibus   Et in terra pax hominibus EmptyFri 28 Dec 2018, 23:06

@Nielsen wrote:
Quote :



Re yours, "Lady returning from revalidation to the house on the last day of 2018 with a new hip...not too much time..."



There are uneasy times, Paul, when one must say that ’such is life’, I hope you’ll soon be able to concentrate on the good sides of what’s happening, that your good Lady has and shall receive the help and instructions enabling her to rest and continue her - and your - life as you'll both want to. Perhaps a comment to the revalidation people on what seem to be realistic in just your*) situation and what not.

There might be something in the instructions you haven’t noticed, which could have given support to Madame or to you, point out that with better instructions could be personalized and perhaps received better. A cool brain and a warm heart on their side could be a God-send to the patient instead of a standard pack handed out by a Civil Servant to a client.*)

 

My best wishes for a good recovery with the help and good instructions from physiotherapists**) that will be needed.

 

*) Note: ‘Just William’.




**) Note: As I actually know next to nothing about Belgium's health care, I can and am here speaking in general terms.

 

***) Note: I have occasionally felt the need to call such staff ‘physio-terrorists’, as they can and do - at least here - chase patients around doing lots of exercises while apparently doing bu***r-all but watching themselves. A comment from me to them have at such times been along lines that ‘there’s nothing too hard or complicated for he, who doesn’t have to do it himself.’

 

Take care of yourselves in the times coming up.


Nielsen, thank you so much for your friendly and compassionate message. And here in Belgium we have still a good care and cheap, they come from the Netherlands and even from the UK to Bruges, even from the West of Germany (but not anymore, the insurances sent them now to the cheaper East German health care)...and a female "kinesiste" some 300 metres from us and a lot money return from the health care for her services...and perhaps as it is a lady..but they can I suppose as terrorist as the males...but we have experience about her from the past...

And LiR thank you also for your wishes:
Paul, I hope things will go as smoothly as possible for your wife upon her discharge from hospital.

Kind and warm regards to both from Paul.
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Res Historica History Forum :: The history of ideas ... :: Religion and superstition-