Subject: Titles, Appellations and Names - Assorted Sat 07 Aug 2021, 12:24
Assorted is a word I think needs more exposure.... so. Americans seem to like being a Republic yet hanker after titles. I suppose it gave extra clout in the jazz world - Count Basie, King Oliver, Earl Hines, Duke Ellington come to mind- and of course actor John Wayne was called The Duke. Of course his being so very right wing he had to distance himself from his birth name Marion. Children there may be named Prince - not sure if it is allowed here. I wonder if being named President would be allowed anywhere. Europe used to have Archdukes and such and perhaps still does. Of course such names without the definite article lack provenance....'The' is a great clout boost of authenticity. As for the bow and scrap bits such as HRH - they seem to mean a lot to the holder. I recall Princess Di's dismay losing her extra handle on her divorce - much as her son Harry is peeved for losing his. Some Scots have a few choice handles too - but none spring to mind.
Last edited by Priscilla on Sat 07 Aug 2021, 18:04; edited 2 times in total
Temperance Virgo Vestalis Maxima
Posts : 6895 Join date : 2011-12-30 Location : UK
Subject: Re: Titles, Appellations and Names - Assorted Sat 07 Aug 2021, 13:13
I was once given as a very useful Christmas present a copy of Debrett's Etiquette and Modern Manners. The section on "Correct Forms of Address" is utterly bewildering - I am glad I have never had to agonise as to how I should address the younger son or daughter of a Marquess; or, really intimidating, found myself fretting over the correct letter opening, or the spoken form of address, in the unlikely event of my writing to, or conversing with, a hereditary peeress in her own right. I just know when chatting to such a distinguished lady I should never say, "Listen, love..." and certainly never begin an email with "Hi"!
If our site manager ever returns, perhaps he could confirm that the name of an Irish Chieftain should always be prefixed by the definite article, as in "The McGillycuddy of the Reeks". The only exception is when referring to O'Conor Don - this gentleman's name is NEVER prefixed by "The". The McGillycuddy of the Reeks's wife is to be addressed as Madam McGillycuddy of the Reeks. What a minefield! I have not made this up - it's in my book. The forms of address when speaking of the clergy (C. of E.) is also an absolute nightmare - is it Right Reverend or Very Reverend or Quite Reverend? Their wives are to be addressed as plain "Mrs." because Elizabeth I disapproved of the Protestant innovation of married clergymen (all that awful sex going on in the English parishes) - our Virgin Queen refused to grant even married bishops' wives the titles of their husbands (as in: "The Right Reverend Lord Bishop of Durham" - no "Lady Bishop of Durham, thank you). These ladies simply did not exist!
PS If you ever have to introduce the Holy Father (the one in Rome), you say: "May I present His Holiness the Pope" and refer to him afterwards as "Your Holiness", not "Your Right Holiness", or "Your Very Holiness". Debrett's guide covers every eventuality - just in case. No one wants to be guilty of an embarrassing faux pas.
Last edited by Temperance on Sat 07 Aug 2021, 16:39; edited 1 time in total
Meles meles Censura
Posts : 5119 Join date : 2011-12-30 Location : Pyrénées-Orientales, France
Subject: Re: Titles, Appellations and Names - Assorted Sat 07 Aug 2021, 16:32
"It's ma'am as in ham, nor m'arm as in farm!"
Green George Censura
Posts : 805 Join date : 2018-10-19 Location : Kingdom of Mercia
Subject: Re: Titles, Appellations and Names - Assorted Sat 07 Aug 2021, 18:25
I like the Scots use of "of that Ilk" as in Moncreiffe of that Ilk
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Subject: Re: Titles, Appellations and Names - Assorted